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Nationalsolo

Start/End buttons in Clip Preview

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Hi NCH

Is there a reason why the START/END buttons do not appear under the Clip Preview window when the clip is selected from the clip bin but they DO appear when the clip is selected from the timeline?

It seems inconsistent  that one can only trim the clip (using the buttons) once it has been added to the timeline. For some it's more intuitive to..

  1. Select the clip in the bin
  2. Trim the clip in preview
  3. Add to timeline position using Place.

The only difference  that I can see is that trimming from the timeline makes  the changes immediately (since the clip is already on the timeline) and the changes are not transferred to the clip in the bin.  But preview trimming the clip  selected from the bin  using just the brackets and adding to the timeline with Place gives the same final result but it leaves the clip trimmed in the bin.

Does it need to do this?  Why does it need to leave the clip trimmed and why can't it behave like the timeline clip preview trimming, and  have START/END buttons that jump to the preview cursor line, (then followed if needed by Place?)

It would be more logical.

Nat

 

 

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2 hours ago, Nationalsolo said:

Hi NCH

Is there a reason why the START/END buttons do not appear under the Clip Preview window when the clip is selected from the clip bin but they DO appear when the clip is selected from the timeline?

It seems inconsistent  that one can only trim the clip (using the buttons) once it has been added to the timeline...

Humm... The opposite appears here.  The START|END buttons are available only when the clip is selected from the bin, and not on the time line.  Trimming from the bin does indeed leave the bin clip trimmed.  Seems logical.  START|END show up only when the viewing window is in clip preview mode here, not when in sequence mode.

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Hi Borate

" Humm... The opposite appears here.  The START|END buttons are available only when the clip is selected from the bin, and not on the time line.  "

Just checking.........  🙂

Nope! I'm right 🙂

If clip selected on the timeline; clip preview shows the START/END buttons (Below) Note timeline clip is selected and VP is in Clip Preview mode. Logically there is no Place button as clip is already placed on timeline.

sa7uf.jpg

When used with cursor line and the buttons the clip is trimmed on the timeline automatically.  The bin clip stays "complete"  so it can be reused if necessary. That's fine but.......

If clip selected in the bin; clip preview does NOT show the START/END buttons.(below) Logically there is a Place button now in order to put the result on the timeline.

saByU.jpg

Without the buttons trimming the clip has to be done by dragging the square brackets (WHY?) and then placing it on the timeline. It achieves the same end result as the top method, so why no buttons and why does it leave the bin clip "trimmed"

My question is:.. Why isn't the preview window the same for both methods (apart from the Place button) and why is the clip left "trimmed" It doesn't need to be. It  shouldn't make any difference if you trim the clip before you place it or whether you trim after you have it on the timeline.

" .....START|END show up only when the viewing window is in clip preview mode here, not when in sequence mode." 

That's logical.   Sequence preview doesn't show the buttons as it's not a single clip (even if it were it wouldn't show even them.)  No, my comments were concerning Clip preview. But are you sure yours are opposite to what I see (above)?

Nat

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The tabs at the top of the preview window confirm that both of your images are displaying clip preview mode.  Why START|END are missing in the lower image is unclear, but the interface has changed some - as it always does - with subsequent versions.

When the timeline clip is clicked here, the interface switches to sequence mode.  No START|END tabs, which never appear when clicking on the timeline clip - only the bin clip.

It acts this way when the HOME mode (on the menu bar) is active.  However, when in CLIPS mode the buttons appear, whether a clip is clicked in the bin or on the timeline.   In that mode the clip can be trimmed from the bin, which truncates the clip as you note, or it can be trimmed from the timeline, which does not.

Perhaps that clears some confusion.

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Hi Nat,

What version of VideoPad are you using? On v6.10, I can see the buttons regardless of whether I am previewing a clip in the bin or a clip on the timeline.

Borate, what happens when you click on a track clip and then switch to the Clip Preview tab? I imagine you would be able to see the two buttons.

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The menu bar mode makes a difference, Jimmy.  (Beta 6.20)  My most recent post has been revised to explain more fully.   A UI inconsistency, perhaps?

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In Nat's above images, it seems that the window has been resized quite small. We know this because some of the buttons have been collapsed into one button.

I think he'll see the Trim buttons if he resizes his clip preview window or maximizes VideoPad. 

The bin clip preview has a 3D Options button which takes up a lot of space, whereas the track clip bin preview doesn't. Probably a bug, don't see any reason why the track clip preview shouldn't have this button as well.

We can also look into resizing the 3D Options button as well.

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Borate, when you say 'menu bar' do you mean the tabbed toolbar?

Assuming yes, the Clip Preview window automatically resizes when you switch to the Home tab or Clip tab. Which would explain why sometimes you see the Trim buttons and sometimes you don't.

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1 hour ago, JimmyRustle said:

Borate, when you say 'menu bar' do you mean the tabbed toolbar?

Assuming yes, the Clip Preview window automatically resizes when you switch to the Home tab or Clip tab. Which would explain why sometimes you see the Trim buttons and sometimes you don't.

Yes, tabbed toolbar - file|home|clips|sequence, etc.

Start while in the Clips tab and the buttons are visible when clicking a clip in the timeline or bin.  Clip preview is active either way.

Switch to Home tab and the buttons stay visible in both, until the preview window is switched to sequence.  And if Home tab is first working choice, clicking on the timeline won't show those buttons, period.

Bottom line seems to be that the trim buttons don't appear when the preview window is in sequence mode, irrespective of window size, which pretty much explains why Nat's and my observations did not jibe.

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Hi JR

I am using VP Professional 6.10

" I think he'll see the Trim buttons if he resizes his clip preview window or maximizes VideoPad.  "

LOL   Gosh! it's getting complex!! and Doh!   Just found that if I drag out the preview window to the left the Markers appear for both bin and timeline clip preview. (I had shifted it to the right a bit to show more of the 92 clips in the bin area.) Thanks JR!   (Such a little thing!)

Having just found this out (after how many years?😔) - would it not be better when reducing the preview display in size, even to it's minimum, to retain the most useful buttons (the trim markers) and truncate the others?

But still.....Why, when the trim is done from the clip in the bin and the the result is placed, does the clip in the bin retain the trim but when trimmed from the timeline it doesn't?

Nat

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Hi Nat,

Not sure what you mean there.

"But still.....Why, when the trim is done from the clip in the bin and the the result is placed, does the clip in the bin retain the trim but when trimmed from the timeline it doesn't?"

If I understand you correctly, I think you answered your own question a little earlier:

"The bin clip stays "complete"  so it can be reused if necessary. That's fine but....... "

If you trim the clip from the timeline, it shouldn't affect the clip in the bin. A track clip can be thought of as an instance of a bin clip and shouldn't affect the original.

I think you're right in saying that the Trim buttons disappearing isn't ideal; they are more important than some of the other buttons that disappear later. As we just saw, this behaviour can even confuse an experienced VideoPad user. We'll think about how we can fix this. 

 

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Hi JR

What I meant was that in the context of my current project for which I am doing a lot of trimming direct from the timeline in clip preview (as I have added all the clips in one go and are simply topping and tailing so to speak and adjusting transitions as I go along the track,)  I noticed that the bin clips remained "whole" whilst newly added clips to the bin that I trimmed before inserting them remained trimmed in the bin. That seemed a bit inconsistent.  It's academic in any case as it's easy to change the IN/OUT settings.

With regards to the disappearing trim buttons...

"...As we just saw, this behavior can even confuse an experienced VideoPad user...."

I have to laugh at myself here as one gets into a particular way of working and not see an obvious simple error as this. I've even queried  a feature when I had forgotten how to access it.......Doh!  🤔

Could the clip preview minimum width (set using the white bar) be fixed so as to display a maximum of three clip thumbnails horizontally as then the IN/OUT tabs are visible all the time or is this dependent on the computer screen resolution?

Nat

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It's worth noting that a trimmed bin clip's edges can be dragged to original length after being dropped onto the timeline.

IN/OUT buttons are never visible in sequence mode here, no matter what the window size, when the HOME UI is active from the toolbar.  With CLIP chosen, they are.

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